STEPHEN: I do think that if you reach a baseline of success on that show, it's hard to fail
completely. Like, people think of Justin Guarini as a total bust, but that guy still works. Constantine Maroulis came in, what, sixth or seventh, and didn't sell many records, but
everyone knew who he was, and now the guy is a successful Broadway actor. I'm sure there are plenty of past performers -- people who hit the Top 5, even -- who've been reduced to playing every hour on the hour at the
American Idol theme park. But if they were ever super-famous and polarizing, they're probably able to get better work than that.
LINDA: Honestly, if you think about how few pop stars there actually are who are on the level of, say, Kelly Clarkson and Carrie Underwood, their record is not that terrible. It is
certainly a lot better than the record of picking America's Next Top Models, for instance.
STEPHEN: Ha! Well, that goes back to what I was saying about the show being a pre-game for the real world. When America's Next Top Model is over, there's no way to keep peeking in on the aftermath, because there is no aftermath. Whereas this past season ended six months ago, and people are going to spend the next few weeks going
ballistic about how Kris Allen and Adam Lambert's records compare. A few months ago, 30 seconds of a Kris Allen song "leaked" online, and it was actually considered newsworthy. Somewhere on the Internet right now,
many people are squabbling about who's better.
LINDA: Oh, I know where. But I'll spare you. But, seriously, yes. Of course. And to me, that's a perfectly valid conversation. Kris Allen wants to be The Fray. Adam Lambert wants to be David Bowie crossed with KISS. Is one of those choices inherently better than the other, and is it okay that I think Adam Lambert has more talent but Kris Allen is more listenable? You can tell me if it's not.
STEPHEN: I think that's exactly right. My own opinions on the two of them have mellowed, of course, to... basically exactly what you describe. I
guess I'm more curious about what Adam Lambert will do, because he just doesn't seem to fit into the marketplace at all. His originality continues to be wildly overstated, but he seems to want to subvert... something, anyway, and that's pretty interesting.
LINDA: Sure, I think that's right. He has aspirations to rebel, which makes him harder to predict. Although some of that sort of was compromised by choosing to make his first video/single that thing from "2012," which is an incredibly conventional pop-rock song. I'm not saying I'd expect him to pass up the opportunity, but when people are claiming you're the future of music, it's like yelling, "THE FUTURE IS 1992!"
STEPHEN: Well, the future he represents also involves a lot of caterwauling. The dude from The Darkness must hear that guy and be like, "Oh, NOW you want squealing?" He must be rending his puffy pirate shirt in frustration.
LINDA: I think every discussion about being the future of music, of course, has to start with the fact that the kind of people who REALLY become the future of music would never go on
American Idol in the first place. They have very specific aspirations involving popularity, not involving changing the game. Carrie Underwood didn't go on
American Idol to reinvent country. She went on
American Idol to exploit what was already working. The kinds of people who push boundaries are not really interested in doing "Conga" on Gloria Estefan Night.
STEPHEN: Aaaaaaaaaand now "Conga" is going through my head. Thanks loads, Holmes. But I think you're exactly right. So what do you think
American Idol says about fandom? To me, it seems to have really brought out a rivalry among pop fans that's fascinating to witness. It's not like, "Which New Kid On The Block is your favorite?" It involves David Archuleta fans collapsing in tears when David Cook wins.
LINDA: To me, that started with the Clay Aiken people. I don't know what it was, but that was the season when it became
insane. I have told you before about hearing stories of people who claimed later that they were burning his CDs and handing them out on the subway, which is kind of ... unbalanced. After that, it seemed like fans were competing to be the most weird, the most inappropriate, the most overinvested. It's very competitive, and the Internet has been a huge contributor to that. People sign on to tell stories of their own reactions -- "You were crying? Well I was crying
and shaking." These discussions happen every single week. Not among the bulk of the viewers, but among a small subset of people who are so devoted to that show that, while it's on, fandom related to that show is their job.
STEPHEN: Yeah. I mean, whatever floats your boat and all, but the intensity of it is incredible. I grew up around comic-book and science-fiction fandom, and it's fascinating to see that same sort of geeky hyper-competitiveness -- "No,
I am the No. 1 Doctor Who fan! You call that a scarf?!" -- writ unbelievably large, and broadcast worldwide.
LINDA: Well, and it doesn't necessarily translate to record sales. Freakish enthusiasm ain't gettin' the silver polished.
STEPHEN: Exactly. One person can dial the phone a thousand times, but if he buys one CD, that's... one CD. I love the notion of "I love his music so much, I burned copies of it for all my friends!" I bet Clay Aiken really appreciated that kind of support.
LINDA: It's a funny thing about that guy, because aside from Christmas albums, he hasn't sold an overwhelming number of records. But while a smarty-pants like me guffaws at the fact that somebody convinced the world it needed a younger, more redheaded Wayne Newton, that guy tours, he is adored, he goes out and makes a tremendous amount of money. That guy is like, "Laugh it up. I'll be in my gold-plated bathtub."
STEPHEN: That guy could open The Clay Aiken Theatre in Vegas or Branson, and he'd get a contract in the nine figures. I mean, if America would like a flopsy-haired 37-year-old Wayne Newton who can't sing, I will happily sign up for the job.
LINDA: Oh, I have often said I think Vegas is his destiny. He could play Vegas for ten years and retire forever and never have to swaddle his child in anything but cashmere. In Vegas, his performance of "Somewhere Out There" would go over pretty well.
STEPHEN: And why shouldn't it, Linda? What are you suggesting?
LINDA: I am suggesting that there is a limited marketplace for songs about yearning mice.
STEPHEN: Maybe in your world, Commie.
LINDA: I honestly have always found the "the Ruben/Clay season was rigged" theory to be among my favorites. Because it makes all the sense in the world that the money-grubbing producers would rig the competition to keep from having to promote the cheerful, redheaded, freckled, faith-based kid who works with disabled children and comes with his own fanatical fan base.
STEPHEN: Yeah, Clay is an interesting case study in how you can still make insane amounts of money as a pop musician in 2009 -- in his case, by mining a scarce but lucrative vein of "young person who is beloved by old people" mojo. It's an interesting counterpoint to fellow runner-up David Archuleta, who is a young person beloved mostly by other young people. Fans freak out at his shows now, but will they still do so in five years? And, as we've discussed, "#weluvyoudavid" being a trending topic on Twitter doesn't pay the bills. I mean, "#yourgay" is a trending topic on Twitter, too. Who cares?
LINDA: That's why David Archuleta had that partnership with the Build-A-Bear Workshop.
STEPHEN: Ha! God, he did, didn't he? Adam Lambert should team up with Build-A-Bear to make the shiniest dolls in the world.
I have to say, Carrie Brownstein has been curating this incredibly provocative discussion of music, bringing in trenchant commentary by some of the day's leading thinkers. I'm so glad we've been able to come in and write thousands of words about David Archuleta and the Build-A-Bear Workshop.
LINDA: I am what I am.
STEPHEN: Me, too, dude. Is there anything we're forgetting?
LINDA: Only the greatness of Jasmine Trias.
STEPHEN: Over time, I've been building my castle of love, just for Charles Grigsby, who was fond of singing Stevie Wonder's "Overjoyed" in season one. And who can forget Carmen Rasmusen, whose name I still know how to spell for some reason?
LINDA: Smoke up, Jason Castro!
STEPHEN: Aw, Jason Castro. Any winners we've forgotten to name-check? Oh! Jordin Sparks! She beat out Blake Lewis, who threatened to bring beatboxing to the pop charts before utterly failing to do so.
LINDA: Hey, don't tug on Blake Lewis's cape.
STEPHEN: I got no beef with Blake Lewis. And then, of course, there are the people who seemed like they'd be also-rans but managed to carve out successful mid-tier careers for themselves: Kellie Pickler and Bucky Covington, for example, and Elliott Yamin. Jennifer Hudson, who got booted early but won a freaking Oscar and can hardly be considered mid-tier.
LINDA: I've seen a copy of Bucky Covington's CD somewhere, but I can't remember where it was.
STEPHEN: On the off chance that
anyone still reading this is someone who hasn't visited my desk, I have 17 copies of Bucky Covington's CD lining my windowsill. Because: BUCKY COVINGTON!
LINDA: There is also Fantasia, who went to Broadway.
STEPHEN: Right, of course! I am probably wrong about this, naturally, but Diana DeGarmo -- runner-up to Fantasia in season three, not that I remember or anything -- really does seem to have disappeared completely.
LINDA: No, not at all. She is in theater also. She was in
Hairspray for a long time.
STEPHEN: See? Shows what I know! [Punches self in face.] Okay, let's see if I can do this:
Season one: Kelly Clarkson over Justin Guarini.
Season two: Ruben Studdard over Clay Aiken.
Season three: Fantasia Barrino over Diana DeGarmo.
Season four: Carrie Underwood over poor Bo Bice.
Season five: Taylor Hicks over Katharine McPhee.
Season six: Jordin Sparks over Blake Lewis.
Season seven: David Cook over David Archuleta.
Season eight: Kris Allen over Adam Lambert.
Wow. [Takes drink, stares into middle distance.]
LINDA: Quick: Who's the president?
STEPHEN: Hold on. [Scrambles to access Wikipedia.]
LINDA: Right. I knew you had to get those brain cells from somewhere.
STEPHEN: Seriously, just
imagine all the things I don't know. Like, I
think I could name all the continents in the time it took me to type all that.
Antasia!
No, wait, I think I'm mixing two continents up with the winner of season three.
LINDA: Katharine McPhee was in
House Bunny! If I could forget that, I could learn French.
1:15 AM ET | 11-13-2009 |
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