Weekly Roundtable Discussion: Let's Play Publicist

[clayMaine-iac]

....topic formerly known as the Sunday Roundtable Discussion.   I am pleased to announce the new title and some exciting new ideas for the roundtable!    In the spirit of cooperation, with goals of more fun and more weeklong discussion, the Admins and Moderators here at Claymaniacs have decided to "change things up" each week for the roundtable. And you all get to help promote our new campaign. Please PM your ideas for the roundtable discussion to any Mod or Admin, and we will take turns bringing the discussion here to Clay Daily each week.  We will make sure we give credit to all suggestions as we use them.  We can't wait to hear your ideas!

Now on to this week's discussion.  The credit for this topic goes to Philly!! Philly for the great idea! 

Back in the late 80's-1989 to be exact, Donny Osmond had a new cd. And what his record company did was to have KISS100 New York play " Soldier of Love" as a mystery song and try to guess who it was.  Well, that song caused such a clamor it was on the radiowaves for a long time and other radio station caught on and started to play that song as well.   It really helped promote him and when it was revealed to be Donny Osmond his records sales went throuhg the roof!

This was her question:

So my question is, do you think if Team Clay were to use the same idea, would that increase records sales and his fandom?

That is a good question, and will make for some interesting discusion, but let's take it one step further this week also:

Can you think of any unusual or creative ways to promote Clay's CD???

If we were Clay's publicist, and money was NO object, what would we do to promote ATDW?!?!

[HavinaClayAffair]

I've always thought that, if we just had ONE DJ in our back pocket...and he/she would just play Clay's...anything- Broken Wings, or When I See You Smile, Lonely No More, or most especially, Lover All Alone- ..anyone of the songs of the DJ's choice..WITHOUT saying WHO it was, it would not only create a "buzz" after it was revealed, but we, as fans, would get a SOLID, unjaded response to not only the song selected, but afterward, to Clay as an artist.

How hard would that be to do??

I don't think people are turned off by Clay's songs and sound and music choices as much as they THINK they are by Clay, himself.

Until, and if ever, he reaches through, I don't expect anything to change. Maybe one Clayversion at a time...through already exisiting fans, but not as mass appeal.

I wish I had the answers to have the average music listener just LISTEN to Clay and his voice...and even his song style, I think it really would put the Justins and the like lower on the charts.

I am not sure anyone really cares though. Voice over beat of a song? I really don't.

I would love to have RAW singing, one against another, picking on Justin here, only because he seems to be one of the hot tickets now...

and see if ANYONE chose him, having NOT knowing who each artist is, over Clay. Same song, same style, no visuals involved...voice alone.

I would be surprised if the outcome actually swang to the side of a Justin.

Lora

[HavinaClayAffair]

With added thoughts on the topic...

Why NOT put out a video of LIVE Clay. I don't mean a recorded Clay Aiken Christmas, but an actual LIVE video. Not American Idol Clay- but Concert Clay. NOT Christmas Clay but Concert Clay. What about that whole concept is seemingly going unnoticed by his "handlers" of his career?? It has been discussed on this board as well as others over and over again!

I really think a HUGE boat was missed by choosing NOT to release a video of the JukeBox Tour.

It didn't have to be from one concert alone, but a compilation of various venues he performed at. With good sound and lighting and crowd participation.

I hope there is a niche out there that is going untapped for Clay to be recognized.

Not everyone uses the internet. Not everyone who uses the internet looks for Clay mp3s, or videos or YouTube or montages or concert photos.

There is still a large untapped market for Clay and I wish the "powers that be" find it.

Hey- all this stuff goes without saying.......RADIO FREAKING PLAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Not snoozer songs either!!!!

I am done.

Lora

[Pamela]

Good stuff Lora!

I don't think RCA particularly knows how to market a vocalist. RCA is mainly a rock label, and the vocalists they do have, such as Christina A, Heather Headley and Clay just don't get that much promotion in general.  Christina and Kelly probably get the bulk of it, because they have the whole pop or rock flavor as well as the singing chops.  Heather Headley is an amazing singer, but I never hear her on the radio or see her on TV, or in magazine articles.  She played Nala in the Broadway production of Lion King, so maybe that's where her fan base lies as well.

If you've read any of the music biz articles lately, you know that CD sales are down for almost every label, and nearly every artist, not just Clay.  I don't think the labels are putting a lot of $$ into anyone's promotion right now, and several artists have suffered for it, such as Janet Jackson.  She always got a huge amount of promotion in the past, but not this time, and her sales have been lackluster, for her anyway.

Anyway, promotion! I agree that Clay needs to be heard.  Can't wait to hear everyone else's ideas!
 

[GWENN]

I HAVE THOUGHT A LOT ABOUT THIS.  THE BIGGEST MISTAKE, I THINK, WAS IN NOT MAKING A VIDEO FOR Without You THAT WAS A STORY.  NOT CLAY IN FRONT OF MIC SINGING.  YOU CAN SEE HIM ENOUGH ON TV DOING THAT.  I LOVE THE IDEAS WE TALKED ABOUT WEEKS AGO ABOUT THAT.  Without You IS A STORY.  HAD IT BEEN DONE IN A SENSUAL WAY, IT COULD HVE BEEN USED ON VHI OR MTV OR SOMETHING.  I LOOK AT CARRIE'S VIDEOS AND THEY ARE FABULOUS.  BEAUTIFULLY DONE.  SENSUAL NOT SEXUAL.  THEY ARE PLAYED ALL THE TIME.   MORE FANS.  THE GIRL IS CLEANING UP. 

Broken Wings IS ONE OF THE MOST BEAUTIFULLY PRODUCED SONGS CLAY EVER DID.  HOW ABOUT THAT TO RADIO?  NO ONE COULD CRITICIZE THAT SONG.  IT IS INCREDIBLE.  OR EVEN A Thousand Days TO RADIO AS THE NEXT SINGLE.

CHOOSING Without You AS THE FIRST SINGLE, WHILE GORGEOUS, WAS A MISTAKE.  IT DIDN'T SHOW CLAY'S DIVERSE TALENTS.  THERE WAS NOTHING INNOVATIVE OR ORIGINAL ABOUT IT. 

CLAY HAS TO BE SHOWN AS DIFFERNT FROM WHAT HE WAS.  THAT HE HAS GROWN.  THAT HE IS MORE SENSUAL NOW.  WE SEE IT.  BUT THE AVERAGE NONFAN DOESN'T.  THAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN THE WHOLE PROMOTION.  IT STARTED WITH THE HAIR AND PHOTOS.  THEY WERE WONDERFUL.  BUT THE SONG CHOICE WAS NOT. IN ORDER TO GET SOME YOUNGER FANS, HE HAS TO SEEM YOUNG AND "ALIVE." 

AS MUCH AS HE HATES THE PUBLIC EYE THING, HE NEEDS TO BE SEEN OUTSIDE OF THE TV SCREEN.  HE USED TO GO TO THINGS.  OK, HE HATED IT.  WE ALL DO THINGS WE AREN'T THRILLED WITH FOR OUR JOBS.  PUT ON A HOT OUTFIT AND GO TO A PREMIERE OR SOMETHING.  REMIND  PEOPLE YOU ARE THERE.  GET YOURSELF IN PEOPLE.  JT DIDN'T PUT OUT A CD IN 4 YEARS, BUT HIS FACE WAS EVERYWHERE.  PEOPLE DIDN'T FORGET WHO HE WAS. 

JUST SOME IDEAS.

GWENN

[Pamela]

CLAY HAS TO BE SHOWN AS DIFFERNT FROM WHAT HE WAS.  THAT HE HAS GROWN.  THAT HE IS MORE SENSUAL NOW.  WE SEE IT.  BUT THE AVERAGE NONFAN DOESN'T.

Megan Mullally saw it - she called him a Hot Rock God!

THAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN THE WHOLE PROMOTION.  IT STARTED WITH THE HAIR AND PHOTOS.  THEY WERE WONDERFUL.  BUT THE SONG CHOICE WAS NOT.

Yep.... good one GWENN!  

Hey, he could parachute into someone's wedding, singing "Because You Loved Me...." now that would get some press.

Or, he could actually sing his award presentation at the AMAs later this month!

Has that been done?  Hey, it's different anyway!

[franniek54]

I screwed up before so please ignore my partial shouts that are floating around.  This is what I was trying to say:

I know nothing about the music business but-

*I think a professionally done concert DVD is a great idea

*I love it when I'm shopping and I hear some great music coming out of the ceiling.  I've become interested in several artists that way, that I would not have sought out otherwise.  With the xmas shopping season coming up, it would be great to play alot of MCWL music in the stores which could stimulate more sales for that CD and probably ATDW as well.

*I think Clay is being marketed to the wrong demographic.  He should not be compared to Justin Timberlake et al.  He should be categorized and compared with Josh Groban, Michael Buble, Harry Connick Jr., Celine Dion, Anita Baker, Dianna Krall, etc.--a more sophisticated and melodic group.  I can't help it if Clay is an old soul, that's the kind of music that he likes to sing.  And isn't that what it's all about anyway--an artist nurturing his artistry?  The affore mentioned artists know and appreciate who their fans are, and so does the media.  They don't suffer nearly as much abuse as Clay does either.  When you find your niche and the fit is right, everything falls into place.

*That being said I'm not sure that anything more should be done to promote the CD--just let it find its own audience.  It's so drastically different from MOAM that the word of mouth has got to be all over the place.  He may lose some teenie-bopper, bubblegum fans, and gain some AC fans.  But it's going to take awhile for it all to shake out, months maybe even years.

This is the thing tho--do you think Clay even wants to be more famous?  I have a feeling that he would rather have an appreciative, loyal fanbase that allows him to live a comfortable life and do the work that is important to him.  He's not a greedy man, and when you have too much celebrity it just makes you a target for abuse.

[GWENN]

Megan Mullally saw it - she called him a Hot Rock God! Purple Banana

SHE COULDN'T HELP IT, PAMELA.  SHE WAS RIGHT THERE NEXT TO HIM.  TOUCHING HIM.  NO ONE CAN RESIST THAT.   

GWENN

[clayMaine-iac]

I think Clay should go on the Country Music awards and sing a duet with Dolly Pardon to "Here You Come Again". 

[GWENN]

I think Clay should go on the Country Music awards and sing a duet with Dolly Pardon to "Here You Come Again". 

BRILLIANT IDEA, DEANNA.   

GWENN

[PHILLYLUVSCLAY]

I think Clay should go on the Country Music awards and sing a duet with Dolly Pardon to "Here You Come Again". 

MAYBE IT MIGHT HAPPEN...

I'M HOPING IN THE FUTURE THAT TEAM CLAY WILL PUT THEIR THINKING CAPS ON AND DO SOMETHING PRODUCTIVE!

AS I ASKED IN THE BEGINING, WHAT CAN THEY DO? 

TO ME, SOMETHING LIKE THE UNEXCEPTED COULD HELP AS IT DID FOR DONNY OSMOND IN THE LATE 80'S

I WOULD TO HEAR "LOVER ALL ALONE" ON THE AIRWAIVES THE SUPRISE SONG, WITH THE MYSTERIOUS SINGER (CLAY AIKEN)..

BUT AGAIN, IT DOES BOIL DOWN TO MONEY....IS HE MARKETABLE ENOUGH FOR EFFORT THROUGH THEIR EYES...I SURE HOPE SO!

THANKS FOR A GREAT THREAD DEANNA! 

LOVE YA

PHILLY

[redhotclay]

I don't understand why Clay isn't being marketed?! Doesn't RCA want to make money?!  There are so many ways to go with Clay.  Yes, I think that he should be marketed to a different demo like michael buble, etc.    I just read that Michael Buble was multiplatinum with his current album.  It doesn't take a genius to figure this out - why can't RCA????  ~Susan is RedHot 4 Clay!

[Boomer Aries]

I may be in the minority here but I like the choice of 'Without You' as the first single from ATDW.  It shows Clay's vocal range and he sings it with a lot of emotion.  I have a feeling that no matter what song had been chosen there's a couple of AC radio stations here that just wouldn't include it on their playlist.

It seems that the best way to reach a large audience (and prospective CD buyers) is by TV appearances. 

[ACcountryFan]

If i were Clay's publicist i wouldn't stretch him too thin which is what so many acts have done to their career's. I think in the beginning Clay was being too exposed in all of those magazines and just about every TV and radio interview program that dealt with pop music was getting him to do interview after interview after interview which for a Clay fan is great but a non-fan who already has their mind made up, they'll more than likely develop resentment. Me, personally, i don't need to see Clay on the red carpet of each and every awards show that there is or need to see him schmoozing around with the superficial Hollywood crowd. I think he, and it's only my opinion, hates that kind of stuff as well so he doesn't do that often unless it's unavoidable.

RCA is known as a rock label in my opinion because of Elvis records of the past and i do believe RCA at one time would sign just about any act marketing themselves as "rock" even if the act became a one-hit wonder. They had a great roster of country acts, too, under the guidance of Chet Atkins but in the mainstream it was Elvis that put RCA on the rock music map. The trend continues today and with RCA being known as a rock label, i don't really think they know how to market Clay, who is NOT a rock singer. He can look like one and can play that part but his voice is too good to be a quote "rock singer". Also, rock music has more to do with the physical than the vocal in my opinion.

I would publicize Clay as i have always felt he was. Adult-Contemporary...singing songs that perhaps sound contemporary but are appealing to adults. It was brought up about Michael Buble being multi-platinum. That has a lot to do with airplay on AC/HOT AC stations and his label knowing how to get the music on the radio. Clay must be satisfying RCA with little to no airplay or else they would've figured out a way to get airplay so many singles ago. If it were anyother artist they wouldn't have been given all of these chances at having a radio hits one after the other so i don't know what RCA's is planning but without promotion or airplay, sales aren't gonna be good for any artist no matter how new or established they are.

In the beginning i would have promoted Clay as an AC artist and the ones in charge of seeing to it the songs are played on the radio, should have been promoting Clay years ago at radio instead of RCA coming across as if they could care less if his songs are played or not. A lot of people in radio i would imagine would take that as a slap in the face since it's an egotistical business. Radio wanting the control to make or break an artist...and Clay having success without them to some degree...and RCA not really caring, it appears, if Clay gets airplay or not. I think "A Thousand Days" is a good single for AC/HOT AC. "Without You" is a ballad...and while i like him singing ballads, too, i would have lead off with an up-tempo song first that would catch a person's ears first and then draw them in as the months go by. On the country side of things, Alan Jackson having "Like Red on a Rose" as a single in the fall/winter months was a mistake because it's a ballad and it reached #15-Country but had it been released late summer/early fall it would've gone higher based on the mood of a listener.

I would, if i were RCA, grasp the audience that works for Clay instead of these silly hodge-podge efforts lately. Stick with what works and build upon that and not stray too far from a proven formula for success. Clay in my opinion doesn't need to conquer the world. He just needs to sing songs, do the TV show circuit, and TOUR all over America if being a recording artist is what he wants to be.

[aikenseeker]

*I think Clay is being marketed to the wrong demographic.  He should not be compared to Justin Timberlake et al.  He should be categorized and compared with Josh Groban, Michael Buble, Harry Connick Jr., Celine Dion, Anita Baker, Dianna Krall, etc.--a more sophisticated and melodic group.  I can't help it if Clay is an old soul, that's the kind of music that he likes to sing.  And isn't that what it's all about anyway--an artist nurturing his artistry?  The affore mentioned artists know and appreciate who their fans are, and so does the media.  They don't suffer nearly as much abuse as Clay does either.  When you find your niche and the fit is right, everything falls into place.

Hello Franniek! Welcome to Claymaniacs!

Interesting comments in your post. I too have often wondered why they compare Clay to people like Justin Timerlake when his style, though he does rock it up a lot, really is more in line with the true vocalists out in the music industry.

He's a performer who cares about his fans, who stands by what he believes in and who puts 110% into everything that he does.

I do like the idea of the way they promoted DO's single back then. I acutally remember that. I'm dating myself, I know but still, I remember it.

The industry gives AI winners and runner-ups a hard time because they don't feel they've earned their place in the industry however, I bet if HALF of the people at the top of the charts these days had to go through the challenge of American Idol they'd never make it.

I'd like to see what would happen if they really did what Lora said they should do. Release a song like Broken Wings, or better yet Like Lover All Alone and don't reveal who the artist is.

Play it, maybe 2 or 3 times a day and don't reveal it, maybe make a contest out of it. Once the artist was revealed it would be interesting to see what would happen to people who liked the song when they didn't know who it was and then backed out when they would find out that it was Clay. Or, at that point maybe it wouldn't matter, maybe they'd like the song and be surprised.

Of course, that would only happen in an ideal world.

The music industry is so political I'm amazed people have any shot in it at all.

For me I think they should have promoted the song on radio first, gotten a bit of airplay out of it, a bit of buzz and then swooped in with the television promotion once everybody was talking about it.

Course that's just me. 

[Pamela]

Megan Mullally saw it - she called him a Hot Rock God! Purple Banana

SHE COULDN'T HELP IT, PAMELA.  SHE WAS RIGHT THERE NEXT TO HIM.  TOUCHING HIM.  NO ONE CAN RESIST THAT.  

I'm sorry...but I had to quote my quote above. That "purple banana" thing just made me laugh really hard. 

He should be categorized and compared with Josh Groban, Michael Buble, Harry Connick Jr., Celine Dion, Anita Baker, Dianna Krall, etc.--a more sophisticated and melodic group.

Good point FrannieK, and welcome! 

Clay has said he wants to sing the songs he enjoys singing. From seeing him in concert a few times I think he enjoys singing beautiful, emotive ballads as well as upbeat pop tunes.  So, if you put the melodic with the emotive and the upbeat, I can see a new type or genre of music.  Sort of a meaningful, adult type of upbeat pop ballads. 

Seriously though, I always think back to something Mr P said during AI2.  He said Clay was successful with female fans (moreso than male fans) because he sings TO women. His demo songs were mostly love songs, his audition was a love song, his AI songs were mostly love songs. Then came Measure of a Man. What's this? Not so many love songs.  So, perhaps they decided to return to the "formula" that brought the fans in the first place.  Clay mentioned early on that the theme could possibly be love songs, even before the covers mandate was made.

I think Clay's new "look" plays to this romantic notion of love songs. I think the Days of our Lives appearance is brilliant promotion. These songs are mostly about romantic love after all, which is one of the biggest of the thousand ways to love. 

IF they could have released this CD around Val Day this year, it would have been a perfect tie in to the holiday of LOVE, and the promotion would have been much easier. 

Even so, I sure am glad they didn't wait until next Val Day! 

[franniek54]

Thank you all for the welcome!

I would hate to see Clay be overexposed to the point of making the public gag.  We've all experienced that before.

It seems to me that maybe Clay's current TV appearances are geared at restoring his reputation as much as promoting the CD.  It feels like everybody is sort of walking on eggshells right now, waiting to see if Clay will be warmly received or rejected inlight of the bad publicity of the last year.  Maybe that's why RCA didn't fully commit to this CD.  Seems like Clive Davis just gave up on the project, said let's get this over with and gave him a list of songs to choose from that they already have the rights to.  Somehow he needs to overcome that bad publicity and maybe highlighting his personality is the best way to go about it.  I like the fun Clay, but I'd like to see more of the smart, thoughtful Clay.  He should have done a PSA for Unicef.

And I just need to say this while I'm venting.  The way that Clay ended the discussion about his sexuality--it's time to do the same thing with discussions about his appearance too.  If any more TV hosts comment on his pre-AI appearance and then show a picture of him post-makeover, you will hear me screaming all the way to Hollywood.  Who of us didn't look goofy in our teens and twenties?  And most celebrities change their look with every public appearance anyway.  The whole thing is just getting very old.  Maybe Clay needs something to talk about right now that's non-volatile, so I'll overlook it for now, but I hope it becomes a non-issue soon.

I hope Clay can prove to RCA that he is not a liability and come out with another CD right away--one that is somewhere in between MOAM and ATDW--not too teeny-bopper and not too depressing.  I love ATDW, it's beautifully executed and I listen to it all the time, but only a few of the tracks are what I would call uplifting.  I was expecting something more fun--like his concerts.  When the CD does get airplay I hope they choose the songs carefully.

[Pamela]

If i were Clay's publicist i wouldn't stretch him too thin which is what so many acts have done to their career's. I think in the beginning Clay was being too exposed in all of those magazines and just about every TV and radio interview program that dealt with pop music was getting him to do interview after interview after interview which for a Clay fan is great but a non-fan who already has their mind made up, they'll more than likely develop resentment.

That's a good point too Jerry. I think some people confuse American Idol promotion with Measure of a Man promotion. In fact, you have made me curious as to just which of his appearances back in 03 were album oriented. 

I feel a list coming on!

Radio wanting the control to make or break an artist...and Clay having success without them to some degree...and RCA not really caring, it appears, if Clay gets airplay or not. I think "A Thousand Days" is a good single for AC/HOT AC.

Yep yep yep.

Clay in my opinion doesn't need to conquer the world. He just needs to sing songs, do the TV show circuit, and TOUR all over America if being a recording artist is what he wants to be.

Great post Jerry, thanks for sharing.

If any more TV hosts comment on his pre-AI appearance and then show a picture of him post-makeover, you will hear me screaming all the way to Hollywood.

  So true FrannieK, so true!

I think many people talk about everything but the music because for some reason, Clay sometimes seems reluctant to talk about music.  Maybe because he hasn't had any really meaningful music to talk about.

Or maybe he would rather just sing!

[PHILLYLUVSCLAY]

OKAY, HERE'S A CRAZY IDEA....

MAKE A VIDEO....

BUT SOMETHING NEEDS TO BE DIFFERENT, LIKE TELLING A STORY WITH HIM IN IT...

MAYBE FOR "HERE YOU GO AGAIN'  LIKE MAYBE, SEEING AN OLD GIRLFIREND AT PARTY, AND SHE FLIRTS WITH HIM AND IT BRINGS BACK OLD MEMORIES OF THEM TOGETHER....

WELL, CRAZY RIGHT? 

[franniek54]

How about an UNPLUGGED episode or video.  I loved that accoustic set done in concert, and BSOB is really charming.