Sunday Roundtable Discussion: Mandates

[clayMaine-iac]

From our TYRA BANKS THREAD:

When he was talking about album and what it consisted of and and she asked WHY COVERS? and he said CLIVE DAVIS MANDATED!!!

From ENCARTA DICTIONARY:

man·date
1. authoritative order: an official command or instruction from an authority

So now lets speculate and extrapolate (TM Ms. Pamela) about this news. Ms. P for today's discussion topic.

What are your thoughts on this??
Why do you think CLIVE DAVIS mandated this type of CD?
Do you think he should have?
Please share all your thoughts and ideas here. 

Only rule:  No Clive bashing, please.   

[Glory]

                              WOW FIRST ONE HERE. I THINK CLIVE KINDA FORCED CLAY INTO THIS.BUT ON THE OTHER HAND CLAY COULD HAVE SAID NO. OR COULD HE ????????????????????????????????????. MY DAD TOLD ME ONCE YOU MAY NOT LIKE SOMETHING YOUR BOSS HAS TO YOU DO BUT HE IS STILL THE BOSS,

                             SALES HAVE NOT BEEN AS GREAT AS I THOUGHT THEY SHOULD BE,BUT DECENT.IS CLAY HAPPY WITH THE SALES NO.S I WOULD BE LYING IF I SAID YES.I GET THE IMPRESSION CLAY GAVE IN TO CLIVE BUT I BET CLIVE IS KICKING HIMSELF IN THE A** FOR IT.I DON'T THINK CLIVE  REALIZES WHAT HE HAS WITH CLAY.SINCE I AM NOT AN INSIDER WHO KNOWS.



                              DON'T GET ME WRONG I LIKE THE CD BUT I SENT ONE TO HOLLIE SHE SAID IT MADE HER SAD,EXCEPT A COUPLE. I FIND MYSELF SKIPPING SOME OF THEM SORRY.

                               SEEMS LIKE THE GARBAGE OVER THE PAST YEAR HAS AFFECTED HIS SALES I THINK THE FACT HE CAME UP AGAINST JUSTIN TIMERLAKE AND OTHER BIG NAMES DID NOT HELP MAYBE IF RCA HAD WAITED A COUPLE OF WEEKS THAT WOULD HAVE HELPED.I THINK. BUT  I AM NOT A INSIDER 

                                 TRUE CLAY HAS HAD A NUMBER OF APPEARENCES BUT IT DID NOT AFFECT THE SALES NO.S SO FAR  WHAT HAPPENED TO THE MILLIONS OF FANS WHO VOTED FOR HIM ON AI. I LOVE CLAY AND HIS VOICE HE IS THE BEST PERSON OUT OF MOST TODAY.

                              I THINK THIS CD THAT CLIVE MANDATED IS IS GOOD BUT NOT WHAT ANYBODY EXPECTED THERE ARE A LOT OF UPBEAT LOVE SONGS.THAT COULD HAVE BEEN SELECTED . I AM NOT SAYING THAT I DO NOT LOVE CLAY BUT I WOULD LIKE TO STRING CLIVE UP BY HIS TOENAILS. I HOPE I DO NOT OFFEND ANYBODY BUT THIS IS MY TAKE ON THE WHOLE MANDATED THING. WRITTIEN BY GLORY.
                             

[clayfannj]

I will play the DEVIL'S ADVOCATE since there is a whole range of possibilities from.. CLIVE is the Savior of Clay's career to...He is SATAN INCARNATE....


Perhaps at the moment the final decision of what to do  needed to be made, it was at the height of "THE TROUBLES."  To predict which way Clay's career would go and be effected was nothing more than a crap shoot at that point..!!!  PERHAPS..Clive took the safer road and said.. "Why take a chance with all this new good stuff and have it tainted by the "SWIRLING SEWAGE!!" 


He could have decided to go more  modestly..safer..  (an older person tends to think like that) This would keep Clay out there...assure decent sales, and then when things calmed down and there was the distance of time between Clay and the ugliness..his TRUE SOPHMORE album would be ready to appear.

Life and BUSINESS is not only about talent and skills.. TIMING can make or break you...

                                                    JUST SAYin'!!

[cpnina]

I agree, maybe because of the uncertainty of the response, because of the negative publicity, "safe" was thought to be more prudent..

I don't think it made Clay especially happy, but I think he let Clive be happy.

Just my opinion!!!

[Glory]

                                      I THINK TIMING IS EVERYTHING. TO.

[GWENN]

CLAY IS VERY YOUNG IN THE BUSINESS, A VERY NASTY BUSINESS.  I DON'T THINK THE CRAP HAD MUCH TO DO WITH IT.  THE MUSIC BUSINESS IS LOADED WITH CRAP.  ALMOST EVERYONE WHO IS A STAR IS TAINTED WITH CRAP.

I THINK CLIVE HAS AN IMAGE OF WHO CLAY'S FANS ARE.  HE THINKS WE ARE ALL BLUE HAIRED LADIES.  I REALLY THINK HE DOES.  I THINK HE WANTED THIS CD TO BE SAFE FOR SURE, BUT NOT JUST BECAUSE OF THE CRAP.  ROD STEWART WAS TOLD WHAT TO RECORD ALSO.  HEARD THAT FROM ROD'S OWN MOUTH.

THE WORD MANDATE IS A VERY STRONG WORD.  CLAY IS A SMART MAN AND WOULD NOT HAVE CHOSEN THAT WORD IF HE DIDN'T MEAN IT.  CLIVE SAID---THIS IS THE CD YOU WILL MAKE.  CLAY CANNOT, AT THIS POINT IN HIS CAREER, TELL CLIVE NO.  HE JUST DOESN'T HAVE THAT KIND OF POWER. 

THE LOVE SONG, COVERS IDEA IS NOT GREAT, BUT CLAY COULD HAVE CHOSEN SOME MUCH BETTER SONGS.  LOVE IS HAPPY.  LOVE IS JOYFUL.  MOST OF THE SONGS ON THE CD ARE NOT HAPPY OR JOYFUL.  WAMLAW WOULD HAVE BEEN AMAZING ON THAT CD.  SKIP Sorry Seems to Be the Hardest Word AND INSERT THAT.  LOVE SONGS DON'T HAVE TO BE SLOW.  I KIND OF AGREE WITH SOME FRIENDS THAT CLAY HAD A THEME IN MIND.  A TONE. 

I LOVE THE CD BECAUSE OF CLAY'S VOICE.  BUT I LOVE ME SOME UPBEAT CLAY ALSO.  ROCK IT OUT CLAY. 

INTERESTING THAT OTHER THAN THE LAST 3 SONGS ON THE CD, MY FAVORITES ARE THE BONUS TRACKS.  FOR DIFFERENT REASONS.

MANDATE MEANS YOU HAVE TO DO SOMETHING.  CLAY DID WHAT HE WAS TOLD. CAN'T BLAME HIM FOR THAT. 

GWENN

[Glory]

                                       WELL AS A REDHEAD I TAKE OFFENSE AT CLIVE'S REASONING THAT WE ARE ALL BLUE HAIRED LADIES. BUT I HAVE NOTICED I HAVE SOME GREY HAIR I BLAME IT ON CLIVE  NEVER BLAME IT ON AGE IS MY MOTTO.

                                        AS FAR AS ROD STTEWART I HAVE HEARD SOME OF HIS NEW STUFF DOES NOT IMPRESS ME AT ALL.

                                    I WAS WONDERING IF IT IS MORE EXPENSIVE TO PUT OUT A CD WITH ORIGINAL STUFF THAN DO A COVERS CD. IF IT IS THAT EXPLAINS A LOT.

                                       I ALSO HAVE WONDERED IF CLIVES INVOLEMENT WITH AI MAKES ME A BIT NERVOUS CAUSE OF THE SIMON FACTOR. I DID NOT MEAN TO STRAY FROM THE MANDATED TOPIC BUT I HAVE BEEN THINKING ABOUT THESE THINGS ALSO.

[stargazer]

Hi everyone.

Good topic

Well I was dismayed when it came out that the album was mostly covers of the 70's and 80's. I know how my kids and their friends responded to him covering their favorite songs. They went ballistic with WDC  and  all the journey songs. They all think Clay has a good voice mind you, but felt  covers were not a great idea. I suspect then that a lot of people of that era  would  be of the same mind.

Therefore I was shocked when Clay said it was Clive's idea. Then when he repeated it in every interview I began to think Clay was putting the message out so he could  point the finger at Clive if it didn't do well.

After the Tyra taping I think that is exactly what he was doing and now he chooses a stronger word to describe Clive's involvement.

So I think he had a lot of pressure to get the CD out. Remember he said he was having trouble finding good songs. He also said that the were all full of angst and sad. Well, what did we get. SAD, lonely, etc.
It just does not compute in my mind that he thought this was a great idea.

Then why would Clive a genius in the music arena make such a suggestion or mandate.

Needed to get it out and Clay was being indecisive.

As I remember Clay went head to head with Clive over his first CD. Maybe it was time to put the boy in his place. I mean to succeed  as   Clive has you need to have a pretty strong  and aggressive personality.
This kinda sounds far fetched but... still something to think about.

Another possibility is that they misjudged the strength of Clay's fanbase since AI2. It is not as strong, because those who unlike us saw only that it was a contest between Ruben and Clay, drifted away and lost interest because of the prolonged wait.

Personally I think the rumor crap did not influence Clive. AS  Gwenn said this is not unusual and no one has really gone down from these kinds of scandals. I mean a few who were charged with murder sort of became also rans but other than that no. However, it might have had an impact on Clay and his confidence that he could make it past the garbage and therefore he was more indecisive and caved when pressure was applied.

Well, it's all worth pondering, and these are just my thoughts, and I think honestly it was a combination of Clay being stressed and his ability to get the work done was evident to Clive and Clive intevened and made the decision for him but  misjudged the fan base.

[clayMaine-iac]

Does anyone remember this article?:

Simon predicts ...
Over the next few years, you will see more emphasis on artists appealing to an older audience. No question about it. We are going back to an era when artists like Frank Sinatra and Dean Martin were selling to people 40-plus. That is why Elvis Presley and the Beatles were so successful -- because they were selling records to 18-year-olds and 50-year-olds.

Norah Jones is a good example, and that is why she has sold so many records. Josh Groban is another example, and Clay Aiken.

Mark my words.

USAWEEKEND

Granted this comes from Simon Cowell, but I am using it as an example to show what those associated with AI and music in general think about Clay's fanbase. I also read a couple of interviews with both Simon and Randy Jackson where they have stated that they think Clay is successful because he has "stayed true to his fanbase" (meaning the blue-haired gang).  I really do think that Clive and his cohorts believe that Clay's fanbase is comprised of lots of older fans.  And it is!!!!

I think that Clay's older fans have been extremely supportive of him and his career.  We are an "informed" group of people who support him with our money (CD buying and Buble/Aiken projects) and our hearts (website enthusiasm and polls) and our ventures (concerts and TV appearances).  So I figure we are TRULY one of Clay's greatest assets. 

And there is not a thing wrong with this!!  It is good for Clay's career.

But therein lies the rub.  We are not the ONLY fans that Clay has.  I think Clay could be just as successful putting out a CD of new and trendy radio-stylized hits.  And that would certainly increase his fanbase and would appeal to more of the younger fans.

I think that where Clive is short-sited, is in the fact that he didn't give us older fans enough credit.  I feel like he didn't believe we would support a trendy, new style from Clay.  But I think we all would have.  I know I would.  Just because I am an old, does not mean I have to listen to only a certain type of music.  I can enjoy lots of different styles.

[GWENN]

I think that where Clive is short-sited, is in the fact that he didn't give us older fans enough credit.  I feel like he didn't believe we would support a trendy, new style from Clay.  But I think we all would have.  I know I would.  Just because I am an old, does not mean I have to listen to only a certain type of music.  I can enjoy lots of different styles. Wink
   

 

THIS SUMS IT UP PERFECTLY, DEANNA.  WE WERE THE ONES WHO GAVE BOB DYLAN A CAREER.  GAVE THE ROLLING STONES AND THE BEATLES CAREERS.  JANIS JOPLIN.  JIMI HENDRIX.  KISS.  AS WELL AS SIMON AND GARFUNKLE, JOURNEY, ETC.  WE HAVE ALWAYS HAD ECCLECTIC TASTE.  WE STILL DO.  THAT IS WHERE CLIVE MESSED UP. 

AND CLAY CAN SELL ANY SONG PUT IN FRONT OF HIM.

GWENN

[ILClaymate]

I think that where Clive is short-sited, is in the fact that he didn't give us older fans enough credit.  I feel like he didn't believe we would support a trendy, new style from Clay.  But I think we all would have.  I know I would.  Just because I am an old, does not mean I have to listen to only a certain type of music.  I can enjoy lots of different styles.

Deanna you do bring up some good points.  This one stuck out at me.  If this is indeed true, not only did he not give the older fans enough credit but he didn't give us younger fans enough credit either.  Clay has said he doesn't want to be 'pigeon-holed' into a certain genre but by mandating that he sing an album of mostly covers seems to me that he is being pigeon-holed to one certain demographic.  I'm not saying that younger fans do not like ATDW.  I'm sure most of them love it as do I.  But I think to gain alot more new, younger fans such as Kelly did, an original CD with more uptempo/positive songs with videos on MTV and even radio play would have been the direction to go and I have a feeling that is what Clay and Jaymes' original CD ideas were.   JMO but I think this is why Kelly has had such great success.  She was able to get away from the AI shadow for the most part by being original and taking chances.  Not by doing safe, cover songs similar to what was done on AI.  I think Clay did his absolute best with whatever options Clive did give him and was able to change the songs up and add his own style to them to make him happy.  That is what is important to me....that he is happy.  He knows he did the best on each song but that his hands were tied.

[fhmmany2]

I think Clive suggested this for Clay simply because it has worked for so many other singers - I bet there are 10-12 cover albums out now - most of them produced by Clive Davis. But all of those are from artists who have already had long careers - Barry Manilow, Rod Stewart (his American Songbook series has sold 15 million Cds so far), Bette Midler, etc. I love to hear Clay sing covers (I think that once he sings a song he owns it), but this Cd should have had more new songs - I cannot understand, after the good response that new songs got during the JBT, that at least those songs were not on this Cd. I really thought that "Back For More" would have been a radio hit for Clay, and it is as much of a love song as several others on the Cd.

I agree that the "old" songs are popular. After Country stations, the second highest number of stations in this country are Oldies stations (I read that recently in Time Magazine!) I'm not sure, though, that the 80s was the best decade to choose! I think that this decision was based upon the success of other Cds by other artists, instead of really looking at what was best for Clay.

[Pepe]

I think at this point in Clay's career he needs to have a variety of songs on each CD to cover all ages.  Once he is established than he can do what ever he wants as he will have a large enough fan base to sustain him.  I do remember reading where Clay said they do not write songs now as good as they did in the past.  I agree with him to a certain point.  I just don't agree with the songs that were put on this CD.  Some of them are very, very blah!!  I will put the CD in and before you know it I am not hearing it my mind has gone some where else.  Now this is bad and I love Clay as much as anyone.  Now if Clay would have said no to some of these covers and not done the album would it have blackballed him in the music industry, if Clive Davis can do this or is it better to put out a so so album?  The problem is Clay waits to long to put out the album, I sure hope I don't have to wait another three years.  My hubby says Clay needs to be in the studio recording right now on another CD.

[ACcountryFan]

I held off making commentary until now. In my opinion while the CD is wonderful vocally from Clay and many of the songs allow him to show off his voice, the topic about Clive Davis mandating the CD to be released doesn't surprise me. He is the boss and while we all get the sense that Clay pretty much picks and chooses his material, the covers idea as we know was from Clive...but it isn't Clive's fault that so many are unhappy...at least i don't think it's Clive's fault entirely. Here's why...

I think the CD is excellant but there are just too many negative remarks out there feeding off one another causing the CD as a whole to be viewed as a failure. While it may be true that Clive insisted that Clay do a covers CD, i still feel that Clay personally loves the songs he chose...they're mostly 1980's pop that Pepe had mentioned...making it the style of music a lot of people his age grew up listening to. The way i see it, Clay works for RCA records and everyone higher-up is his boss and while under contract, has to issue albums the label wants. Clay has his input on the CD's i am assuming as much...so it isn't just RCA or Clive Davis "out to ruin Clay's career" as i've seen written elsewhere at the site. Clay is a part of this as well. I think Clay saying the CD was mandated by Clive created this illusion that Clay was helpless in the creation of the CD and in the minds of so many, it was as if RCA said: "sing these songs".

I feel RCA/Clive Davis came up with the covers CD concept and Clay picked what songs he wanted to sing.

[Tessie]

Why do you think CLIVE DAVIS mandated this type of CD?
Do you think he should have?

I apologize that I have not had the time to thoroughly read everyone's posts on the subject, but while I have a free minute, I will throw in some thoughts.

To answer the second question first, I think that it is Clive's job to get his client's CD's out to the public in as timely a manner as he can manage.  For whatever the reasons, it was taking a very long time for Clay to get a CD finished and ready to sell.  The entire process is costly.  The business, RCA, needs to recoup its expenditures, and therefore, they had to get the CD finished.

I do not know what the problems were.  I can make guesses, but with no facts I could easily be as wrong as right.  It is my guess that Clive took a look at Clay.  Not looking at the fanbase, but at the public.  Clay had been out of sight for a while.  Again, many who remembered and liked him from AI, liked the type of performances they had seen.  That, coupled with the fact that cover albums seem to be the "thing" at the moment, to me seems a logical move on Clive's part. Perhaps Clive considered this to be a transitional CD covering what was remembered, before branching into someting new.

I am not ready to call it a "mistake".  The sales have been good.  I expect that they will be steady throughout the holiday season.  I fully expect the album to go platinum.  It may take some time.  I do not know what RCA's expectations are with regard to sales and with regard to what is timely.

Should Clive have "mandated" this CD?  It is Clive's job to make these types of decisions.  If there was something hanging the process up and a decision had to be made, then, yes, Clive should have mandated this CD.  Again, I am not privy to all that goes on behind the scenes, but if a mistake was made, then it rests on Clive's shoulders as it should with any boss.

I do not agree that they are trying to force Clay into a box, but rather that they are still searching for the best audience for Clay's music.  In my opinion, his music crosses all demographics, but this is not always apparent and so RCA is experimenting to find out where he goes rather than realizing that he goes everywhere.  That is what happens when a unique talent appears...it simply cannot be put into conventional spaces.

I see this CD as just another step on the road.  I actually love it and am glad it was made.  I do not know that I would have liked something original better.  How could I know that? This is my own opinion, but I feel that many fans did not like the CD before they heard it, wanting it to be something else.  I have no way of knowing if they would have liked the "something else" better.  Probably some of them would have and some of them wouldn't have. I just think that a lot of minds were made up early.  I do know that Clay does at some point need to have original material.  I know that he needs a great song that will be know as a "Clay Aiken" song.  I also know that this will happen in time.  Sometimes I think that the fandom is too impatient.  Things take time.  Roads are often bumpy.  Clay is young and talented and will have a long career if that is what he wants. 

[Prissy]

Hello!

I may be wrong, but I think Clive Davis is a driving force behind Rod Stewart's successful "new" career singing songs of the past.  And I don't know if Clive is involved with Barry Manilow, but now Barry is putting out CD's of different decades. 

Perhaps Clive sees Clay in this "grouping' of artists. Clive may think that if Rod and Barry are successful with this type of album, Clay should be, too.  Personally, I think Clay can sing rings around Rod Stewart and he has a better voice than Barry.

I still think Clay needs an original song that will appeal to everyone and will send his "star" straight up.  A song that can become "his."  Hope it happens soon.

Prissy

[Tessie]

I cannot understand, after the good response that new songs got during the JBT, that at least those songs were not on this Cd. I really thought that "Back For More" would have been a radio hit for Clay, and it is as much of a love song as several others on the Cd.

I am sorry to go off the subject, but although the fan reaction for BFM and TRD was great, and I truly agree that I would have liked them to be on a CD, the fact of the matter is that we don't know what else would have been on a different "original" CD.  Many of us think that Clay can sing "anything", but because many of us think that, it doesn't mean that "everyone" thinks that.  Perhaps Clive did not care for the material that Clay presented and wanted him to take a road that he felt was "safer".

[ACcountryFan]

Prissy: Clive founded Arista Records in the early '70s and he "discovered" Barry Manilow and signed him to a recording contract in 1974 on Arista...Clive is credited with "finding" most of Barry's 1970's hits that Barry himself didn't have a hand in writing. So it isn't unusual for Clive to have an active role in all of "his" artist's careers.

[clayharmony]

I held off making commentary until now. In my opinion while the CD is wonderful vocally from Clay and many of the songs allow him to show off his voice, the topic about Clive Davis mandating the CD to be released doesn't surprise me. He is the boss and while we all get the sense that Clay pretty much picks and chooses his material, the covers idea as we know was from Clive...but it isn't Clive's fault that so many are unhappy...at least i don't think it's Clive's fault entirely. Here's why...

I think the CD is excellent but there are just too many negative remarks out there feeding off one another causing the CD as a whole to be viewed as a failure. While it may be true that Clive insisted that Clay do a covers CD, i still feel that Clay personally loves the songs he chose...they're mostly 1980's pop that Pepe had mentioned...making it the style of music a lot of people his age grew up listening to. The way i see it, Clay works for RCA records and everyone higher-up is his boss and while under contract, has to issue albums the label wants. Clay has his input on the CD's i am assuming as much...so it isn't just RCA or Clive Davis "out to ruin Clay's career" as i've seen written elsewhere at the site. Clay is a part of this as well. I think Clay saying the CD was mandated by Clive created this illusion that Clay was helpless in the creation of the CD and in the minds of so many, it was as if RCA said: "sing these songs".

I feel RCA/Clive Davis came up with the covers CD concept and Clay picked what songs he wanted to sing.

Hello folks...

Jerry,    I agree with so much of your post, especially the parts I highlighted in yellow.

I've been thinking about this topic for awhile today and I reflected on some of my recent observations...

1.  In my trips to music departments over the last year, I see less and less inventory...less diverse CD selections,  music stores going out of business...the most recent, Tower records...and less foot traffic in this section of the store...where is it busiest?  Over by the computers/electronic gadgets et al.

2.  The young people in my life, from my students (11 -12 year olds) to those in their twenties...speak only of downloads...not CD purchases...and their tastes at the moment, pretty narrow...hip hop, R and B, alternative, rap...some country, some Latin based music.

3.  My students regularly tune in to MTV, American Idol and Dancing with the Stars.  They are also some of the least educated in musical forms in my recent memory. (Thank NCLB, and the lack of any arts education to speak of in this country...for sure my home state, California)

So how does a mega music Mogul interpret trends?  If he's worth his salt, IMO, he's going to look at two things...the earliest return on his investment, and building some longevity in his customer base.  How do these areas bode for Clay?

Well, Clay's Cd's have certainly had a solid return on the label's investment.  Consider though when each was released...the first - right after AI2 and the Clay/Rubin interest was all over the media, the second - aimed at a seasonal market, Christmas.  Neither involved any risk on the part of RCA. 

Now comes the third...and this is when the RCA execs are hard pressed to read the market...are his fans all that traditional?  Who are his fans, anyway? What impact is the mess on Clay?  Again, we're not talking risk taking here, are we?  The head of this company seems to divide music tastes into two camps:  top 40 trendy, and traditional AC, with a separate labels for country/urban sounds.  I do think he has cast Clay into the second camp and made his decisions accordingly.

What is interesting to me, the overall direction of the music industry as it pertains to the delivery of new product.  I think music departments, laden with Cd's, will be a thing of the past, just as sheet music stores are headed.  (And the the library card catalog, now dead and buried.)  Those companies who continue to be highly profitable will devise exciting mechanisms  by which customers may download their desired musical selections, videos and related media. 

As to a solid, customer base, around for the long haul, I remain quite optimistic for Clay.  My students love ATDW and ask for it daily.  Why?  I think they find the arrangements and song selections to be a bit novel...certainly a departure from what is now the steady diet on top 40 stations.  So with the return of even a modest amount of arts education, and the innate love of beauty which I believe dwells within us all, even our young, I think Clay's performances will endure, and in fact triumph over the less substantial musical offerings presented today.

I myself love this CD!  I love the instrumentation, I love the arrangements, I love how Clay uses his vocal instrument to perfection.  I think the 'pop' music critics simply don't have the musical chops to get it.  I don't mean set the musical snob vibe in motion, but trained musicians love his work on this.  I do think it will go platinum...it's going to take some time, based on the poor inventory of the CD as so many reports indicate at the CH.  Would I have like to hear Clay perform original music?  Oh my yes!  And I think it will come.  I do believe Foster's label understands Clay's market and I fervently hope Clay is headed there.  I don't mind a bit if he is in the company of Josh Groban, William Joseph and Michael Buble.  I think it would make for a 'happy home'...and that is what pleases me most...Clay's continued happiness.

[wvclayfan]

It's too late to into the night for me to think about my own opinion, so I'll just WORD Deanna and Clandy.